|
|
Post by nashfan076 on Mar 9, 2023 7:10:59 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by cameron on Mar 11, 2023 10:33:27 GMT
Part two can be compiled from 'Changin Times 1969 - 1973' and 'Head Out of Dreams 1974 - 1988' plus the two mono mixes for 'I Can't Tell The Bottom From The Top' and 'Mad Professor Blythe' from 'At Abbey Road 1966 - 1970', all of which are easily available on streaming services.
I've never really realised that the Hollies have never had a complete singles collection compilation issued before. EMI did 'As and Bs, 1970-1979' in the pretty early days of CDs on the Music For Pleasure label, also EMI did 'As Bs and EPs' which covered a lot of the 1963-1967 material, but there were gaps (the original mono mix of 'Bus Stop' I don't think has ever officially been on CD) and they were all sourced from the original vinyl. Interesting concept, but not ideal. We've also had numerous versions of 'The Other Side of the Hollies' which focuses on their Parlopone years B-sides. But never As and Bs together as a consistent set that covers their heyday era of 1963 - 1975.
I definitely think there's scope for a 1963-1968 set and 1969 - 1975 set, especially as a vehicle to use original mono mixes. 'Jennifer Eccles' is another one that's never made it onto CD in mono officially from the master tapes (the Japanese reissues use a needle drop). I'm surprised it's something that Sundazed in America haven't picked up on. I fairly recently got their reissue of 'Beat Group' in vinyl and I'm going to stick my neck on the line here and say that it might be the best that those tracks have EVER sounded. Crystal clear mono master tape transfers that have had a significant amount of work to re-balance them, give them a bit more punch at the lower end of the EQ spectrum and they've managed to eliminate a lot of the sibilance on Tony's treble-heavy lead guitar from those early tracks. In fact, I'm on a mission to complete the set now, I know the tracks don't follow a UK album, but for the sound quality, I'm prepared to accept that. I also had the Sundazed 'Lost Recordings and Beat Rarities' which sounded amazing but was very fiddly to play all those singles back-to-back.
I just this week got the Dusty Springfield 'As and Bs Collection 1963-1970' that puts the A-sides on disc one and the B-sides on disc two, all in mono of course. Its a neat concise set that I'm sure the Hollies could put together something for their UK singles 1963-1974 like:
CD1:
1) Ain't That Just Like Me
2) Searchin'
3) Stay
4) Just One Look
5) Here I Go Again
6) We're Through
7) Yes I Will
8) I'm Alive
9) Look Through Any Window
10) If I Needed Someone
11) I Can't Let Go
12) Bus Stop
13) Stop! Stop! Stop!
14) On A Carousel
15) Carrie Anne
16) King Midas In Reverse
17) Jennifer Eccles
18) Listen To Me
19) Sorry Suzanne
20) He Ain't Heavy, He's My Brother
21) I Can't Tell The Bottom From The Top
22) Gasoline Alley Bred
23) Hey Willy
24) The Baby
25) Long Cool Woman In A Black Dress
26) Magic Woman Touch
27) The Day That Curly Billy Shot Down Crazy Sam McGee
28) The Air That I Breathe
CD 2:
1) Hey What's Wrong With Me
2) Whole World Over
3) Now's The Time
4) Keep Off of That Friend of Mine
5) Baby That's All
6) Come On Back
7) Nobody
8) You Know He Did
9) So Lonely
10) I've Got A Way of My Own
11) Running Through The Night
12) Don't Run and Hide
13) It's You
14) All The World Is Love
15) Signs That Will Never Change
16) Everything Is Sunshine
17) Open Up Your Eyes
18) Do The Best You Can
19) Not That Way At All
20) Cos You Like To Love Me
21) Mad Professor Blythe
22) Dandelion Wine
23) Row The Boat Together
24) Oh Granny (Terry Sylvester Version)
25) Cable Car
26) Indian Girl
27) Born A Man
28) No More Riders
|
|
|
|
Post by nashfan076 on Mar 13, 2023 0:26:22 GMT
I was figuring I could pull those songs from those compilations. I have all of them too. I don't think the 70s singles had that many variations from the album version either. Maybe just some edits so I don't think it would matter if they didn't come from the original singles.
They should do a compilation like the Dusty Springfield one you mention. I won't hold my breath on that.
I haven't seen that Beat Group Sundazed album before. Doesn't look like it's easy to find. In your opinion what would be the closest CD to it quality wise?
|
|
|
|
Post by cameron on Mar 13, 2023 8:47:39 GMT
The only 1970s single variations were:
1) 'I Can't Tell The Bottom From The Top' was issued in mono, most compilations use stereo.
2) 'Mad Professor Blythe' was also issued in mono, but the stereo mix of this is the one that's difficult to find, as it wasn't done until decades later I think.
3) The single mix of 'Cable Car', which is on 'Singles As and Bs, 1970-1979', seems to just have the acoustic guitar mixed louder and sounds a bit brighter overall.
4) 'Oh Granny' the single version is sung by Terry Sylvester, but it was initially cut with Allan Clarke on lead vocals at the end of the 'Distant Light' sessions. There's quite a few mix differences between the two, the Terry Sylvester version is more acoustic based whereas the Allan Clarke version is more along the lines of the mix of 'Distant Light' with the organ much more prominent in the mix and the fuzz guitar much louder.
5) 'Magic Woman Touch' had a remixed single edit that was much louder and bass-heavy than the album version, but this has never been released on CD as there's a big drop out on the master tape right at the beginning (Thanks to Gee here on the forum who found that out for us). The single version to my ears has the organ more prominent in the mix and the acoustic guitars sound much louder.
6) 'Born A Man' is allegedly different on the B-side mix to the album version, but I can't hear the difference. It was included as the album version on 'Changin Times' and included again as the B-side mix on 'Head Out of Dreams', I *think* they've just turned down Mikael Rickfors' voice on the B-side mix if there's any difference at all there.
I'm not sure on the best source on CD for their early stuff, the 1999 EMI remasters are completely dull and lifeless, especially in mono, they almost sound muddy to me, especially on 'Hollies (1965)' and 'Would You Believe', which I prefer stereo just because the mix is sonically cleaner. I'm surprised how fresh Sundazed got those mono mixes to sound!
|
|
|
|
Post by nashfan076 on Mar 13, 2023 22:26:05 GMT
I really appreciate all the info on these. I'm only missing a couple of those versions. So the stereo mix of Mad Professor Blyth has only appeared on a single?
I'm gonna keep an eye out for the Sundazed Beat Group one. I just got the Evolution cd from them based on your recommendation and it's the best version I've heard.
I also saw a listing for a disc called Manchester Express on the Tendolar label. Supposedly the first Hollies bootleg.It looks like it's some BBC sessions and late 60s B sides and a few "true stereo" tracks from Evolution. If you have it is there anything still exclusive to that disc?
|
|
|
|
Post by gee on Mar 13, 2023 22:48:02 GMT
The original UK Parlophone single 'B' side version of 'Mad Professor Blyth' was actually in mono as also was the 'A' side; 'I Can't Tell The Bottom From The Top'- the final UK mono single released in 1970
'Gasoline Alley Bred' c/w 'Dandelion Wine' was their first stereo single later in 1970
EMI used the stereo 'Mad Professor Blyth' on 'The Other Side of The Hollies' LP in 1978 which was technically incorrect per the format of how the song originally appeared in 1970 on vinyl, this was on CD later as 'TOSOTH...Plus' with two additional tracks
the mono 'Blyth' was later issued on CD
I believe you can find both 'I Can't Tell The Bottom From The Top' and 'He Ain't Heavy' in their mono single versions on the 'Orchestral Heaven' compilation CD - if I remember correctly without digging out a copy !
some years back Cameron suggested a later 'B' sides compilation to me and I sent Tim Chacksfield a combined sixties / seventies 'B' sides two CD set compilation including all the earlier sixties 'B' sides together with Cameron's seventies track listing....
Tim said he'd consider it...still waiting on that tho' it had to get by both Warners and The Hollies Limited
a proper singles 'A' and 'B' set either devoting a disc or two to each..or maybe combining 'A' and 'B' sides together put in chronological order with the original singles mono mixes up to 1970 as released, thereafter in stereo where issued...with maybe some notable overseas singles - both big hits and rarer singles - both sixties & seventies could make a great comprehensive 'classic' Hollies CD Singles box set
- or maybe a larger overall CD set covering Allan Clarke's first to last Hollies singles over 1963 to 1993 plus the Rickfors era singles (if they can now fix 'Magic Woman Touch' 'dropout' intro - failing that use the album version again which is not that different) - yes ?
|
|
|
|
Post by Tony Wilkinson on Mar 13, 2023 23:43:34 GMT
Manchester express tracklist
1 Like Every Time Before
2 What Kind Of Love
3 When I'm Not There
4 Now's The Time
5 Then The Heartaches Begin
6 Stop Right There
7 Water On The Brain
8 Heading For A Fall
9 When Your Lights Turned On
10 I Can't Let Go
11 Times Are A Changin'
12 Reach Out
13 You Don't Know Like I Know
14 What's Wrong With The Way I Live?
15 Relax
16 Tomorrow When It Comes
17 Stop (In The Name Of Love)
18 Mad Professor Blyth
19 Row The Boat Together
20 No More Riders
21 Shake
22 She Said Yeah
23 Nobody
24 Reelin & Rockin
25 Bus Stop
26 Carrie Anne
27 Hollie Daze
|
|
|
|
Post by cameron on Mar 15, 2023 9:00:31 GMT
'Manchester Express' is pretty much completely obsolete now, as it was released at a time when these tracks were hard to find. The stereo mix of 'Evolution' wasn't on CD then, so they present a select few stereo cuts lifted from vinyl. Of course, this was rectified in 1999 when EMI released both the mono and stereo mixes on CD officially. The rare B-sides/unreleased tracks have all become easily available, there's no unique mix variations here. Tracks 21-26 are live at the BBC, but now available in better quality either on the official 'Radio Fun' CD or on YouTube and the odd one out is 'Carrie Anne', which is labelled as from the BBC though I think it's actually the Australian Bandstand version, which again, is both up on YouTube and officially available on DVD.
The only rarity is the Swedish live tracks from 1966 (tracks 10-14), but the tracks are in the wrong order and from an inferior reel to reel recording done back in the 1960s of the radio broadcast. It was re-broadcast in FM quality in the 1980s, and many other sources use that. All of those tracks are up on YouTube in the same quality as presented here on 'Manchester Express'.
On the note of bootlegs; the Hollies must be one of the least-bootlegged bands ever! There must only be a handful of Hollies bootleg compilations that have ever been circulated wider than the private fan base. The last one was 'Shake With The Hollies' on vinyl, which was a Record Store Day special, apparently ruffled a few feathers with Hollies Ltd/Warners, but got released anyway. Arguably a nicer compilation than 'Radio Fun', even though not as comprehensive, at least bunched all the correct era tracks together.
|
|
|
|
Post by nashfan076 on Mar 15, 2023 15:26:05 GMT
I really appreciate all the info that you all have taken the time to provide. Hollies fans are the best. All these mix variations can make your head spin. What I would love to hear is one of the late 60s live shows that included Dear Eloise. I see some setlists from that period here that show it was performed.
|
|
|
|
Post by dirtyfaz on Mar 18, 2023 3:46:12 GMT
My guess would be that several of the last bunch of mono 45 issued in the UK would all be fold downs from stereo to mono.
|
|
|
|
Post by cameron on Mar 18, 2023 13:43:38 GMT
As far as I know, they're all dedicated mono mixes for the late mono singles. Several of the B-sides weren't even mixed into stereo at the time, it would be nice to know exactly when some of them first appeared in stereo. I think some could have been as late as 1993's '30th Anniversary Collection', but I could be wrong. 'Not That Way At All' and 'Mad Professor Blythe' especially usually appeared in mono, though there does at least appear to be a proper stereo mix of 'Cos You Like To Love Me' from the time. 'Sorry Suzanne' is possibly a fold, it sounds a bit flatter/muddier than the stereo mix, though I can't imagine in 1969 they'd be doing folds for single releases, especially one as important for the band as that, their first single post-Nash's departure. 'He Ain't Heavy, He's My Brother' is definitely a dedicated mono mix, with noticeably more reverb on Allan's harmonica in mono and a slightly more prominent orchestra track. 'I Can't Tell The Bottom From The Top' is also a dedicated mono mix as the out of sync guitar is missing I think. The rarity there is the unused 1970 stereo mix that was unearthed for the 2003 'Long Road Home' boxset that removes the out of sync guitar in the middle eight section and pushes the orchestra right up in the mix, neatly panning it across both channels, whereas the more common stereo mix locks the orchestra in mono. I'm sure someone here told me that mix appears on a 1970s Australian compilation, but I could be wrong. It's way sonically cleaner than the usual stereo mix though. PS, nashfan076 'Dear Eloise' was only performed on their early 1968 dates across Asia, one concert recording we know exists, a poor quality audience tape from Tokyo in February 1968, but 'Dear Eloise' from the set hasn't been shared from the tape yet. It was dropped from their set for their May 1968 UK tour with Paul Jones and the Scaffold. Interestingly, 'Very Last Day' performed in Japan in 1968 is the earlier 1965 full band arrangement, but by the time they performed it at the Split Festival of Pop in the summer of 1968, they'd changed to the twin banjo arrangement with just Allan, Graham and Tony performing. |
|
|
|
Post by gee on Mar 18, 2023 22:34:28 GMT
The original 1970 mono single mix and 1972 stereo mix of 'I Can't Tell The Bottom From The Top' (which was first released on 'Hollies Greatest vol 2' in the UK in March 1972 and later included on Singles;'A's and B's 1970-1979') all featured the acoustic guitar from midway
That alternate stereo mix was first included on an Australian compilation LP I believe - Bobby has said he preferred it as the acoustic guitar was indeed out of sync which probably explains why the 'non acoustic guitar' mix was included on 'Greatest Hits' 2CD in 2001 and later
However on any singles compilation the original 1970 mono version with the out of sync acoustic guitar should be the one included as that was the UK hit single
'Mad Professor Blyth' was in stereo on 'The Other Side of The Hollies' in 1978 (I believe then it's first UK stereo release) however both 'Not That Way At All', and 'Cos You Like To Love Me' were in mono on that vinyl LP compilation
on his Facebook Appreciation Page Allan recently advised that the harmonica on the 'He Ain't Heavy' recording was actually NOT played by him but by that 'Wrecking Crew' guy (Tommy ? - can't recall his surname now but he passed away a while back and his playing on 'He Ain't Heavy' in 1969 was duly included in the list of his credited session works)
Allan said the famous harmonica intro and outro on the 1969 recording was a part of the Johnny Scott arranged orchestration...!
That was quite a surprise but if it was indeed direct from Allan....
I always assumed Allan must have played it having heard him do it so often in concerts...tho' in turn Mike, Carl, and Peter all have played it too...while I always thought the orchestration would have been all UK musicians at Abbey Road - like young Elton John on piano etc - rather than a American 'Wrecking Crew' musician, but it seems not
|
|
|
|
Post by Mevrouw Bee on Mar 19, 2023 9:35:17 GMT
The original 1970 mono single mix and 1972 stereo mix of 'I Can't Tell The Bottom From The Top' (which was first released on 'Hollies Greatest vol 2' in the UK in March 1972 and later included on Singles;'A's and B's 1970-1979') all featured the acoustic guitar from midway That alternate stereo mix was first included on an Australian compilation LP I believe - Bobby has said he preferred it as the acoustic guitar was indeed out of sync which probably explains why the 'non acoustic guitar' mix was included on 'Greatest Hits' 2CD in 2001 and later However on any singles compilation the original 1970 mono version with the out of sync acoustic guitar should be the one included as that was the UK hit single 'Mad Professor Blyth' was in stereo on 'The Other Side of The Hollies' in 1978 (I believe then it's first UK stereo release) however both 'Not That Way At All', and 'Cos You Like To Love Me' were in mono on that vinyl LP compilation on his Facebook Appreciation Page Allan recently advised that the harmonica on the 'He Ain't Heavy' recording was actually NOT played by him but by that 'Wrecking Crew' guy (Tommy ? - can't recall his surname now but he passed away a while back and his playing on 'He Ain't Heavy' in 1969 was duly included in the list of his credited session works) Allan said the famous harmonica intro and outro on the 1969 recording was a part of the Johnny Scott arranged orchestration...! That was quite a surprise but if it was indeed direct from Allan.... I always assumed Allan must have played it having heard him do it so often in concerts...tho' in turn Mike, Carl, and Peter all have played it too...while I always thought the orchestration would have been all UK musicians at Abbey Road - like young Elton John on piano etc - rather than a American 'Wrecking Crew' musician, but it seems not Yeah that was "d'oh!" moment for me there, passionately defending Allan's harmonica and slagging off the Variety obit of that Tommy guy only for the man himself to confirm it. Oopsie. It did seem weird that they'd ship over some American to play it...I mean what about visas and stuff? Even Two Yanks depended on local musicians depending on what side of the pond the track was recorded. Oh well, at least Allan proved he had the chops live... |
|
|
|
Post by The Dude on Mar 19, 2023 16:13:41 GMT
The original 1970 mono single mix and 1972 stereo mix of 'I Can't Tell The Bottom From The Top' (which was first released on 'Hollies Greatest vol 2' in the UK in March 1972 and later included on Singles;'A's and B's 1970-1979') all featured the acoustic guitar from midway That alternate stereo mix was first included on an Australian compilation LP I believe - Bobby has said he preferred it as the acoustic guitar was indeed out of sync which probably explains why the 'non acoustic guitar' mix was included on 'Greatest Hits' 2CD in 2001 and later However on any singles compilation the original 1970 mono version with the out of sync acoustic guitar should be the one included as that was the UK hit single 'Mad Professor Blyth' was in stereo on 'The Other Side of The Hollies' in 1978 (I believe then it's first UK stereo release) however both 'Not That Way At All', and 'Cos You Like To Love Me' were in mono on that vinyl LP compilation on his Facebook Appreciation Page Allan recently advised that the harmonica on the 'He Ain't Heavy' recording was actually NOT played by him but by that 'Wrecking Crew' guy (Tommy ? - can't recall his surname now but he passed away a while back and his playing on 'He Ain't Heavy' in 1969 was duly included in the list of his credited session works) Allan said the famous harmonica intro and outro on the 1969 recording was a part of the Johnny Scott arranged orchestration...! That was quite a surprise but if it was indeed direct from Allan.... I always assumed Allan must have played it having heard him do it so often in concerts...tho' in turn Mike, Carl, and Peter all have played it too...while I always thought the orchestration would have been all UK musicians at Abbey Road - like young Elton John on piano etc - rather than a American 'Wrecking Crew' musician, but it seems not Yeah that was "d'oh!" moment for me there, passionately defending Allan's harmonica and slagging off the Variety obit of that Tommy guy only for the man himself to confirm it. Oopsie. It did seem weird that they'd ship over some American to play it...I mean what about visas and stuff? Even Two Yanks depended on local musicians depending on what side of the pond the track was recorded. Oh well, at least Allan proved he had the chops live... His name was Tommy Morgan. Here's the Variety article about his death: variety.com/2022/music/news/tommy-morgan-dead-roots-dances-with-wolves-harmonica-1235308409/?fbclid=IwAR1KFo4bz2pUSpEGG_JZtNNsNtFgi-avmUww6LPl74tYfcXPd0rfydMpzzI |
|
|
|
Post by The Dude on Mar 19, 2023 16:25:26 GMT
And here's Allan's acknowledgement (as a reply to mevrouw Bee's post of July 3, 2022, in the Facebook group Allan Clarke Appreciation Society): "Allan ClarkeTommy Morgan did play the harmonica on He Aint Heavy recording being a part of the orchestration at the time." ( www.facebook.com/groups/335394863294983 ) |
|
|
|
Post by nashfan076 on Mar 23, 2023 1:34:31 GMT
Would this be the single mix of Magic Woman Touch that was mentioned?
|
|
|
|
Post by baz on Mar 23, 2023 12:07:15 GMT
Still on "Magic Woman Touch" I'm surprised it's not been mentioned that the UK Polydor 45 had that in mono, yet the B'side "Indian Girl" is in stereo. That baffled me many years ago when I acquired the 45 as by late 1972, practically all 45's were in stereo with the noticeable exception of Bell Records who were still issuing mono 45's into 1973, maybe even 1974 so I presume "Magic Woman Touch" was the last mono Hollies 45 as far as the UK was concerned.
|
|
|
|
Post by gee on Mar 23, 2023 22:55:15 GMT
That does sound like the single mix - the track has a more 'urgent' intense feel to the single version with more powerful guitar/sitar and sweeping twelve strings and a somewhat deeper tone while the percussion on the bridge section when Terry sings sounded a bit clearer on the album version than in the single mix (to me anyway) presumably due to the wider stereo channel separation on the album version
The Epic single pictured you state is a promo which may explain why it is in mono - however I do recall saying to Tim Chacksfield when he sent me a CD of 'Greatest Hits' for a listen that MWT single (with the 'drop out' on the intro) sounded like it was in mono but Tim said it was a very narrow separation stereo (!) - whatever, it seems an Epic single version 5-10951 was also in stereo if the label depiction here is accurate
it would be great if now they can get the single mix version on a CD or modern vinyl with the intro sounding intact - it may have just required some studio time and money back in 2001 but they opted to just use the stereo album version instead to save time and costs...
|
|
|
|
Post by dirtyfaz on Mar 24, 2023 0:33:51 GMT
Interesting enough Hey Willy was issued as a mono 45 in France but no doubt a fold down from the stereo.
|
|
|
|
Post by nashfan076 on Mar 24, 2023 6:35:32 GMT
I thought it sounded like what you described. I actually like the sound of the single mix a little better. I wish they would have issued it on one of the many compilations by now.
|
|
|
|
Post by gee on Mar 24, 2023 22:10:57 GMT
The Beatles UK single 'The Ballad of John & Yoko' was released in stereo on Apple in 1969 however it incorrectly carried the mono prefix 7Xce instead of 7Yce on the label which presumably was an error by EMI....
... as were some copies of 'Hollies Sing Dylan' on seventies 'silver box' Parlophone label which despite having a stereo label and cover PCS 7078 actually had a mono side two prefix XEX pressed to a stereo side one so some mono/stereo confusion was going on in those days, and maybe Polydor had such a problem re 'Magic Woman Touch' (?) which came after the first Polydor Hollies single 'The Baby' was in stereo
I also prefer the more 'intense' powerful single version of MWT and hope they can by now get it sounding o.k. on CD
|
|
|
|
Post by moorlock2003 on Mar 28, 2023 20:45:59 GMT
Oh brother, another slagging off their albums. Very tiresome. The band recorded many fine albums.
|
|
