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Post by gee on Oct 22, 2022 22:05:27 GMT
we always tend to think Cliff Richard had NO success in the USA however overall Cliff has scored six top thirty hits and some 21 chart singles in the USA (mostly minor chart placings but nevertheless chart singles)
'Devil Woman' made no.6 and 'We Don't Talk Anymore' reached no.7,'Dreamin' made no.10, 'A Little In Love' reached no.17 while his duet with Olivia Newton John 'Suddenly' made no.20
Cliff's association with both 'Livvy' and Elton John via Rocket Records and their duet on 'Slow Rivers' helped boost Cliff's later career profile stateside - when some American Disc Jockey's couldn't believe Cliff had been making records since 1958...!
'Living Doll' reached no.30 and Cliff's idol Elvis Presley had a copy of Cliff's single on his juke box at Graceland
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Post by becca67 on Oct 23, 2022 2:24:29 GMT
Canadian radio was much more open to British artists before the US was . Cliff even had a few number 1s on the Toronto CHUM charts. I think Bachelor Boy was a pretty huge hit in Canada for Cliff, circa 1964. I definitely remember We Don't Talk Anymore, Dreamin' and A Little In Love being all over the radio in their time, might even remember all the words to all of these. The Esquires were such big Shads fans they aped the front cover of the first Shadows LP a bit on their own full length debut... That film was made for a Scopitone audio-visual jukebox. They had them in clubs in France and Eastern Canada in the early '60s, pretty cool to see and hear them by anyone. I wonder often about Cry For A Shadow, the early Beatles instro... was it around the time Tony Meehan or Jet Harris departed? It's a fairly memorable tune and if George Harrison played it on his Futurama it's almost miraculous. Here's an early photo of George posing with Joe Brown's guitar while he was off stage, because he really coveted it at the time!
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Post by Mevrouw Bee on Oct 23, 2022 12:54:52 GMT
Yeah, I meant pre-Beatles. Pretty much everyone knows about his 70s-80s success in North America. But in Canada (at least in Toronto because we had no national chart until 1964), it was different than the US although "Living Doll" did hit the top 40 in both countries.
Otherwise:
Young Ones: 5 CHUM, uncharted US Wonderful To Be Young: (the alt theme to Young Ones, after the North American movie title) 16 CHUM, uncharted US Bachelor Boy: 2 CHUM, 99 US Summer Holiday/Dancing Shoes: 1 CHUM, uncharted US Lucky Lips: 8 CHUM, 62 US It'll Be Me: 14 CHUM, uncharted US It's All In The Game: 1 CHUM, 25 US Don't Talk To Him: 14 CHUM, uncharted US I'm the Lonely One: 18 CHUM, 92 US On The Beach/A Matter Of Moments: 12 CHUM, uncharted US I Could Easily Fall (In Love With You): 21 CHUM, uncharted US The Twelfth Of Never: 14 RPM (our new national chart), uncharted US Wind Me Up (And Let Me Go): 23 RPM, uncharted US Congratulations: 32 RPM, 99 US
And then nothing until the late 70s...
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Post by Mevrouw Bee on Oct 23, 2022 14:02:15 GMT
Which reminds me of one of the few pop star stories I have (considering I can count on one hand the number of concerts I attended as a teenager because Thunder Bay!)...Cliff played here back in 1980 or '81 I believe. My sister-in-law at the time and her husband (at the time) worked backstage and told me that Cliff was running around saying, "My coke! Where's my coke! I can't perform without my coke!" I winced, while they thought it was hilarious (don't ask )...but in retrospect I have to laugh because he was probably one of the few pop stars of the time who would say something like that and actually mean the soft drink!
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Post by baz on Oct 23, 2022 15:21:56 GMT
Which reminds me of one of the few pop star stories I have (considering I can count on one hand the number of concerts I attended as a teenager because Thunder Bay!)...Cliff played here back in 1980 or '81 I believe. My sister-in-law at the time and her husband (at the time) worked backstage and told me that Cliff was running around saying, "My coke! Where's my coke! I can't perform without my coke!" I winced, while they thought it was hilarious (don't ask )...but in retrospect I have to laugh because he was probably one of the few pop stars of the time who would say something like that and actually mean the soft drink! LOL! Poor old Cliff, ever hopelessly naive. Reminds me of the comical story Tony Rivers told in a documentary when Cliff was admiring a guitarist's new pedal and had an idea suggesting a picture of his face on the pedal would make a great album cover. Everyone collapsed into laughter and Cliff was bewildered as to why. The pedal was called something like a "Muff Grinder"... ouch!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 23, 2022 19:26:00 GMT
It does seem that not everyone back in the day was bowled over by The Beatles Sgt Pepper. I don't remember from which magazine this album review came but it is an interesting read.
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Post by Mevrouw Bee on Oct 24, 2022 12:43:30 GMT
It does seem that not everyone back in the day was bowled over by The Beatles Sgt Pepper. I don't remember from which magazine this album review came but it is an interesting read. View Attachment Might be blasphemous to say but when I finally heard the entire Sgt. Pepper album in the mid-70s, I was disappointed. My brother (8 yrs older) and his friends used to borrow each others' albums as young teens but otherwise stuck to singles. So he borrowed (that US/Can hodge podge) Yesterday...And Today and the Magical Mystery Tour but I didn't hear the other ones until Abbey Road. So I played catch-up years later and went "meh" at Sgt Pepper. Just seemed like a lot of filler. And after hearing Rubber Soul and Revolver, my mind wasn't changed. Still think it was one of those albums that you had to hear at the time and was a game-changer but, out of time, it's not one I'll voluntarily play. I liked "She's Leaving Home" and "A Day In The Life" but...*shrug* And Evolution is a favourite. It's all in the tunes for me, I guess.
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Post by gee on Oct 24, 2022 22:40:45 GMT
Interesting point Bee - I know what you mean and I must admit I have always felt Sgt Pepper was never The Beatles er 'Sgt Pepper' !
for me 'Rubber Soul', 'Revolver', 'White Album', and 'Abbey Road' are stronger group and quality song albums overall - even 'A Hard Days Night' sees Lennon far more a creative full on constant driving force as a songwriter and performer
John did refer to them being 'Paul's sidemen' on Pepper
Pepper IS brilliantly recorded and produced even if the stereo mix was limited somewhat - but re songs I only hear four true classics, one other popular song, a great snippet intro and reprise ....and a few fillers by Beatles standards, that is songs that in truth most people would NOT include on any 'top twenty' fav Beatles songs listings
as a concept it goes nowhere (as John Lennon pointed out) but for me it's somewhat 'style over substance' re actual classic songs of top quality with for me four notable exceptions
Paul clearly dominates the set, John seems to just be 'chipping in' bits besides two gems, and George is relegated to just the one song (after three on 'Revolver') seemingly retreating back from being a real third force as a songwriter...and his lone effort (minus the other three Beatles) sounds rather 'Indian restaurant' background music really if we are being blunt - I always felt 'Love You Too' worked better re that eastern style
BUT we were TOLD how fantastic 'Pepper' was - almost ordered to love it by the music press !
so we believed...
but I always felt it was not their best album song wise or re a unified group, or their most balanced as songwriters...
just my view - I know others love it of course, but I suspect some 'brainwashing' has gone on (hence Bee duly citing 'Blasphemy' ! - say three 'Michelles' and an 'Eleanor Rigby' as your pennance Bee !)
- 'Pepper' had a stronger reputation back in the seventies than later when 'Revolver', 'White Album' and 'Abbey Road' have emerged more
'Pepper' IS a piece of pure 1967 tho' (as were other classic albums released that year, some I rate higher), it does perfectly capture a moment in time just as did the TV show 'The Prisoner', the film 'Billion Dollar Brain' and the 1967 season of 'The Avengers' on TV
- all were so completely '1967'
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Post by Mevrouw Bee on Oct 25, 2022 12:45:34 GMT
'Pepper' IS a piece of pure 1967 tho' (as were other classic albums released that year, some I rate higher), it does perfectly capture a moment in time just as did the TV show 'The Prisoner', the film 'Billion Dollar Brain' and the 1967 season of 'The Avengers' on TV - all were so completely '1967' Give me Oddessey & Oracle by the Zombies, along with Evolution and Butterfly, anyday!
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Post by baz on Oct 25, 2022 15:04:50 GMT
'Pepper' IS a piece of pure 1967 tho' (as were other classic albums released that year, some I rate higher), it does perfectly capture a moment in time just as did the TV show 'The Prisoner', the film 'Billion Dollar Brain' and the 1967 season of 'The Avengers' on TV - all were so completely '1967' And so is "Butterfly" - there's no other year that album could have been made and released!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2022 18:06:51 GMT
You do remember when these records were released, Evolution is well over fifty years old.
If by some strange chance they were to spend time and money to improve it sonically, which they won't.
How many folks out there would actually buy it and would it worth their trouble.
You can see now why the current owners of the master tapes can't really be bothered.
The only possibility is for them to sell their publishing rights as a number of artists have now done.
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Post by gee on Oct 25, 2022 22:49:47 GMT
Well the streaming figures do suggest that wider public interest DOES exist in the group - any lack of interest from the music press re how 'fashionable' The Hollies were or are might be overcome by the internet access to music these days
- tho' then the argument over sales of any enhanced album being released on vinyl and / or CD is the big question, and to date both the group and their record company do indeed appear to be 'not that bothered'
But then of course other, often lesser selling, groups back catalogues HAVE enjoyed a sonic overhaul and in depth research....
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Post by becca67 on Oct 25, 2022 23:57:04 GMT
I grew up with the North American Magical Mystery Tour album so for me that was my Pepper's probably. When my brother did get Pepper's in the late '70s I was mostly underwhelmed, although A Day In the Life is a masterpiece... good way to close it! I can get a nostalgia buzz from Magical Mystery Tour but not really from Pepper's, probably a you had to be there situation? I'm trying to think what Hollies I knew from early on and we (or at least my Dad) just didn't have anything of theirs that I can recall, not even a single. So I would've just heard whatever hits they had in the '70s on radio/tv. So finding '60s Hollies, and many Beatles, recordings a stretch of a couple decades or so from their release, whatever respect I have is entirely for their quality (but not necessarily the recording quality). I definitely find Butterfly the peak Hollies album, like Revolver (Parlophone album) was the pinnacle for the Beatles, if only by a nose. often lesser selling, groups back catalogues HAVE enjoyed a sonic overhaul and in depth research.... Having an expanded 'deluxe album' for In The Land Of Pink And Grey by Caravan I would think Butterfly by the Hollies would be at least equally worthy and successful.
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Post by Mevrouw Bee on Oct 26, 2022 12:55:59 GMT
Yeah, funny that. Magical Mystery Tour (the full North American album) was it for me too! I guess because side 2 included all the radio hits? Probably different in the UK where it was only an ep. I mean, the track listing would certainly appeal, especially to a kid like me: So many bands have undergone a reassessment over the years and have become more respected, including some who made more musically progressive eyes roll at the time. The Monkees, Nancy Sinatra, the Cowsills...I could go on. But the Hollies would have to care. And I don't think they do anymore. As for my childhood memories of the Hollies? My brother wasn't into them so it was all radio, especially "On A Carousel", "Carrie-Anne" and "Pay You Back With Interest." "He Ain't Heavy" was a favourite that I used to warble badly around the house when I was eight years old. Never heard "King Midas" or "Jennifer Eccles" or any of the pre-"Bus Stop" songs until the 1970s when I bought a compilation though... And "I'm Alive" and "Yes I Will" not until 2003.
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Post by baz on Oct 26, 2022 13:14:03 GMT
So many bands have undergone a reassessment over the years and have become more respected, including some who made more musically progressive eyes roll at the time. The Monkees, Nancy Sinatra, the Cowsills...I could go on. But the Hollies would have to care. And I don't think they do anymore. Exactly - The Hollies' apathy knows no bounds. I know I said it before somewhere else here, but I'm just incredulous that they persist with their live shows playing "the hits" and have NOTHING to promote... we haven't even had wind of any anniversary "greatest hits" package yet. I also suspect they're mostly playing to ageing audiences... sure there'll always be odd ones under 40 going along but the band are doing nothing to snare them into exploring the band's legacy. The Hollies have a long long history of shooting themselves in the foot and they're yet again proving they're masters of that! I do suspect the expected latest "hits" CD will appear sometime in 2023 as technically they didn't start recording till 1963 so can claim that as their 60th anniversary and what's the betting they've got a bland dreary forgettable "new" song to plop on at the end of it?
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Post by gee on Nov 10, 2022 0:58:51 GMT
Going back to Parlophon Auctions Andrew's original posting - and his blanket 'dismissal' of 'Would You Believe ?' compared to 'Revolver'
I decided to play the 'new 2022 mix' of 'Revolver' by Giles Martin back to back with the mono 1998 mix CD of 'Would You Believe ?' and compare them myself
as was so accurately stated earlier in this thread it's really comparing Apples with Oranges and NOT a fair compare at all
I had not played either album for a while so I came to both after quite a gap
first up 'Revolver' is indeed ground breaking...however it really struck me how MUCH MORE I preferred the rockin' tracks of George's 'Taxman' and John's 'She Said', 'And Your Bird Can Sing' and 'Dr Robert' plus John's lazily catchy 'I'm Only Sleeping', Paul's romantic 'Here There And Everywhere', the Lovin' Spoonful influenced 'Good Day Sunshine' and the soul influenced 'Got To Get You Into My Life' (which the expert guest brass section really made stand out)...to the rest of the set
'Eleanor Rigby' is a classic...but it's really Paul with Strings
'Yellow Submarine' I have never liked much and I always felt this children's singalong ought to have been a stand alone single...with John's song 'Rain' a far better choice to go on 'Revolver' in it's place for me
the other songs to me were a bit average and frankly nothing that special
it was SO noticeable how they were beginning to drift apart re musical styles - Paul and George already wannabe solo artists it felt...only John really holding the band firmly together on each of his songs, so group unity was beginning to dissolve as early as 1966
obviously it's diversity was seen as a major strength...but arguably it was a weakness to an extent as the 'unified Beatles' songs here for me sounded SO GREAT....a pity more tracks were not like that keeping a more focused album in terms of musical style I found myself wondering in retrospect all these years later...(?)
Lennon featuring the whole group approach I felt had the edge here - we do know John got increasingly 'miffed' when Paul would present 'finished tracks' to the group denying the others any chance to contribute to them - the 'White Album' so highlighted that...and encouraged John to go fully solo on 'Julia' of course, but while that song was lovely such drifting apart inevitably would lead to their ending as a group
so while I still loved the album it really hit me how 'coming apart' they were on 'Revolver' - no one is ever allowed to criticise The Beatles it seems (I do) but what was always seen as great innovative emerging individual strengths...arguably was also a loosening of the group unity which was SUCH a key strength of The Beatles
John Lennon seemed to realise the band's unity was SO important then for his songs...even if others wern't so bothered about it always
just an observation from 2022
Bearing in mind Andrew's blanket dismissal of The Hollies album I moved onto it wondering just how it would bear up...
first thing obviously was the covers - only a mere FOUR original songs here (tho' of course they quickly followed this set with their first all originals album shortly after that year)
The power and tightness of the three way harmonies really stood out, plus Allan Clarke's sheer vocal power, and the fact that Bobby Elliott's drumming was not a supportive instrument but rather a front line instrument that was right up front in their sound
While they were still firmly putting established fav covers on the set the mixing of The Byrds and Buddy Holly for 'Take Your Time' worked really well....plus a strong cover of Paul Simon's 'I Am A Rock' stood out
maybe they ought to have included 'She Gives Me Everything I Want' in place of 'That's How Strong My Love Is' ...but it's arguable
the energy on The Hollies album was paramount - while the four original songs each were quite fascinating - 'Hard Hard Year' besides the counter of Hicks electric rock guitar solo over a Dylan style acoustic folky lament featured all too real lyrics even contemplating suicide before a positive outcome...'Oriental Sadness' with it's spiralling vocal tangents (as music authour Alan Clayson so perfectly put it) and unusual key changes for the bridge sections was an imaginative item - 'Fifi The Flea' might be laughed at but - inspired by both their roadie and original fourth member of 'The Goons' Prof Michael Bentine's offbeat comedy show 'It's A Square World'(which featured a Flea circus complete with 'talking' fleas who had personalities...even a Union !) was a tragic love lament narrated in a haunting manner with just Nash solo and his acoustic guitar - breaking new ground then - leading to the style later used on 'Lady of The Island' etc plus both tragic...and so laughably silly all about a bloody flea ! (who had a manager flea)
'I've Got A Way of My Own' dated back to 1965 and was another unusual original song concerning individual self belief, confidence and character with maybe a then topical military reference ? ('I can't believe that the reason their giving will entice me to go...why then deny me the right to start living oh I'll just never know...')- Nash and Clarke swapping their normal vocal roles on this more lyrically complex song as Nash handles verses and Clarke the bridge lead vocal plus final verse
Eric Haydock's finest moment for the group with his thundering six string bass guitar on 'I Can't Let Go' plus Nash ultra high vocal (which Paul McCartney thought might be a trumpet ?) closed the album on a powering positive note
Malc dismissed 'Don't You Even Care' as little more than just a 'filler' track in his book 'Riding The Carousel' but take a listen to Bobby Elliott's powerhouse drumming here, his percussive expertise shines so well here as his drumming is put firmly right up in the musical frontline...alongside Hicks shrill guitarwork and those mega tight three way harmonies each standing out - a "filler" ? no way...!
A straight up comparison with 'Revolver' is pointless and inaccurate - a case of Apples and Oranges indeed - however 'Would You Believe?' is a strong album catching The Hollies at a key point of transformation and is worthy of higher regard than the blanket dismissal Andrew gave it - he needs to revisit the set and judge it on it's own merits and strengths
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Post by eric on Nov 10, 2022 11:12:43 GMT
“Don’t You Even Care (What’s Gonna Happen To Me)” is, IMHO, one of The Hollie’s finest recordings. It has all the hallmarks of the classic Hollies sound. When I first heard this song back in the Sixties, I knew this was a band of substance and class.
The running order of the “Would You Believe” album has never been the best IMHO. In these modern days I have rearranged the track order as detailed below. In the process I cut “Sweet Little Sixteen,” added “A Taste of Honey” and placed the powerhouse “I’ve Got a Way of My Own” as the starting track. Please “Try It”! The mono tracks, of course.
I’ve Got a Way of My Own - Stewball - Don’t You Even Care (What’s Gonna Happen To Me) - Oriental Sadness - I Take What I Want - Hard Hard Year - I Can’t Let Go - A Taste of Honey - That’s How Strong My Love Is - Take Your Time - Fifi The Flea - I Am A Rock
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Post by Mevrouw Bee on Nov 10, 2022 14:51:41 GMT
I'd argue that "Fifi the Flea" is the most covered Clarke-Hicks-Nash composition of all. By no less than The Everly Brothers, The Sidekicks, Paul & Barry Ryan, Ronnie Burns, Four Jacks and a Jill, Mary Black, Svarti Loghin, the Electric Sound Orchestra and a Finnish translation by Lasse Mårtenson with the Rauno Lehtisen orkesteri.
Am I missing any?
I've also wondered whether they saw this Tex Avery cartoon in the cinema as kids...
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Post by gee on Nov 10, 2022 15:42:16 GMT
I should correct one thing I stated above
Malc did NOT dismiss 'Don't You Even Care' as a mere 'filler' track in his book 'Riding The Carousel' - my apologies Malc !
however
In his initial draft which he sent to me to check on 4 January 2020 which I still have archived on my laptop - on page 102 he did originally refer to 'Don't You Even Care' as being...
'a rather uninspiring tune written by Russ Ballard jnr (composer of 'I'm Alive')'
- which was what I was remembering - plus it was Clint Ballard jnr of course not Russ - when I did that posting yesterday
I think I then at the time pointed out the songs merits - at least in The Hollies performance of it - and to be fair Malc DID then reconsider and delete that initial remark in the later revised draft version and finished book (where it appears duly amended on page 122).
hope that clears it up
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Post by gee on Nov 10, 2022 16:20:17 GMT
I suspect the real 'issue' re 'Would You Believe ?' was a key factor in The Hollies then - and later in the seventies too
one of not everbody all pulling together re their overall musical direction, but putting full effort into the various musical avenues opted for instead
hence it's a compromise - the mere four original songs being the most imaginative and adventurous - and we know they had more originals that were not included on the album then
plus some rather 'conservative' factions within the band opting to 'keep it safer' - hence we get 'Sweet Little Sixteen', 'That's How Strong My Love is' and the Buddy Holly song 'Take Your Time' given a more modern Byrds style approach...plus 'I Take What I Want' (a fav live track which The Tremeloes also recorded around then)
folk influence shines through on their much loved 'Stewball' - a horse still racing in their live show with Terry Sylvester in February 1969...!
also they put in the Clint Ballard jnr song, some more contemporary items like the Paul Simon song ...and wisely they close with a big hit single - making for maybe an uneven collection looking forward, around and behind re song styles and influences...but all duly given top craftsman professional work vocally and instrumentally duly making no.16 in the UK album chart which presumably made them quite happy as they were always being dismissed as the 'singles band' by some music writers then and later
with producer Ron Richards ever guarded about the group's strengths and often opting to; 'always play to your establish strengths lads' (as opposed to say George Martin's attitude of;'o.k. lets go for it' approach re The Beatles latest ideas) it meant 'Would You Believe ?' was always going to be a mixture of approaches but mainly played in a uniform manner of strong vocals and supreme musicianship
hence their tag as being; 'The Group's Group'
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Post by moorlock2003 on Nov 10, 2022 19:54:20 GMT
The Hollies, I think, in the scheme of things, pleased their fans more than The Beatles did. The Beatles broke up and left fans sad and looking for some sort of replacement. That replacement turned out to be The Hollies for me. I started buying their albums and had a new favorite band with The Beatles out of the way. Time has not changed my mind. The Hollies are the greatest and I don’t care what anybody else thinks. Their classic 1963-74 period (exactly the time of Top 40 radio’s peak) is brilliant and continues to thrill me. As for individual songs, no Beatles song has the emotional impact that “He ain’t heavy…” has. “The Air That I Breathe” is one of the greatest love songs ever, right up there with “I Got You Babe” by Sonny and Cher. “Long Cool Woman”, to me, is the ultimate Rock and Roll song. The intro (the most distinctive guitar intro in Rock history (and I’m not the only one who has said that), the engaging storyline, the fact that in September 1972 it was blasting from my radio on heavy rotation make me love the band all the more. Add to the fact that I could actually see The Hollies in concert in 1972 while The Beatles were two years into their breakup makes me prefer The Hollies over The Beatles.
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Post by knut on Nov 11, 2022 18:45:11 GMT
Very good, Moorlock. I also started off with The Beatles, but went for The Hollies after Stay and Just One Look. Of course I played I should have known better and Twist and shout, but then The Hollies became my no 1 band and they have stayed up there ever since!
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Post by gee on Nov 12, 2022 0:20:42 GMT
Moorlock raises a key point about how The Beatles did not always please their fans in those days
Some Liverpudlians were always upset re how Pete Best was ousted (George even got a 'black eye' over that !), while others were VERY upset when the Fab Four relocated down to London...and never returned to play the Cavern thereafter that final show where The Escorts with Terry opened for them
John Lennon's acidic reply to such fans upset remark about; 'those moaning now never bothered to come and see us anyway...' - was a good way to lose home town fans support !
Liverpudlians can have long memories if upset - some NEVER forgave footballer Kevin Keegan in the seventies for 'deserting' Liverpool to go and play for Hamburg in Germany !
The Hollies despite being a 'Manchester' (based) group came in as the replacement resident group at the Cavern (where Ron Richards first saw them) met young Terry Sylvester & The Escorts and got on with the Rock & Roll and entertaining the Liverpool crowds - and were 'accepted' and made a fav group at the Cavern (did that get up John Lennon's nose somewhat ?)
whatever, tho' The Hollies later followed The Beatles down to London and to Abbey Road...they always continued playing the UK scene and visiting merseyside while of course The Beatles took off and were soon lost to the country for much of the time
the decision to cease touring in 1966 for whatever reason (?) cost them fans worldwide to an extent as indeed, as Moorlock states, some got into other groups whom they could still enjoy playing live
Groups such as say The Beach Boys - despite losing Brian Wilson as a public performing member for many years - grew their much loved status to a large extent by carrying on touring the world, as indeed did The Hollies
This was of course not lost on Paul McCartney...hence once he formed Wings in the seventies he got back on the road playing low key gigs at students halls (like the old clubs of North England & Hamburg that his former band cut their teeth on) to both tighten up the band and re-establish himself as a live performer with this later group
While it seems hard to envisage any fans being upset with The Beatles back at their home town such a feeling of being let down and deserted WAS apparent...maybe one reason years later Paul went back to play at the later Cavern Club ?
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Post by baz on Nov 12, 2022 1:03:39 GMT
Liverpudlians can have long memories if upset - some NEVER forgave footballer Kevin Keegan in the seventies for 'deserting' Liverpool to go and play for Hamburg in Germany ! Having lived some 11 years of my life in Liverpool I can attest to this. I know this is a diversion from this thread, but... For all the press and hype, Cilla Black was despised in Liverpool as they hated how she parodied their accent and moved away from there to the degree over the last 30-40 years of her life, she barely spent any time there. She had "deserted" them. Of course, since her death its now a different story altogether and on the rare occasions I visit there's ALWAYS people posing with her statue on Mathew Street. When Wayne Rooney moved from Everton to Manchester United, he went from being the most loved footballer in Merseyside to the most hated overnight as he was deemed a "traitor" for daring to go to Manchester United. There are two keys to survival in Liverpool - 1, NEVER slag off The Beatles and 2, never EVER admit liking Manchester United - both are "offences" that will result in a redesignation of your face. Terry Sylvester has certainly made his hatred for Manchester United known many times over! Ringo Starr caused a huge furore - he performed at the Liverpool City of Culture opening ceremony in 2008 then a few days later on Jonathan Ross's show admitted he didn't really have the fondest feelings about Liverpool. That did not go down at all well! I went to some art exhibition not long after which had a large painting of the Yellow Submarine in which sat John, Paul and George. Ringo? He was a mere face, "drowning" in the sea behind it, the artist making it clear he felt Ringo was a traitor. Paul did return to Liverpool with Wings and was treated like Royalty, then there was the infamous and embarrassing pub singalong scene in his "James Paul McCartney" TV special. Theres also a film special based around a 1979 show in Liverpool. Though its not often he's there he does have some residence somewhere on Merseyside so that's "OK" in the eyes of many not to mention his continual work and endorsement of LIPA. It's also worth mentioning that Yoko Ono has also had a very strong relationship with Liverpool, financing many charitable ventures, much of it done quietly. Then it goes the other way - Gerry Marsden lived there till he died, and you wouldn't believe how many ringtones were of "You'll Never Walk Alone"! He was loved and cherished for staying at home and was a local legend for it. He'll forever be immortal in Liverpool and I wouldn't be at all surprised if a statue will appear of him.
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Post by anthony on Nov 12, 2022 3:22:24 GMT
Hi Moorlock, I too was a big Beatles fan, you said something very interesting you said when the Beatles broke up it left fans sad and looking for a replacement, I think that will be true with the Hollies, if they broke up why would you want to be on a site like this, everything would be totally in the past, why would anyone really bother. Big Beatles fan but not on any Beatles sites, everything is 50 plus years ago. Comparing the Beatles and the Hollies is madness, the Beatles would always win hands down. They were the greatest ever.
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